Talk:Ammar ibn Yasir

Ammar ibn Yasir is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination was archived. For older candidates, please check the archive.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
July 1, 2014	Featured article candidate	Not promoted
July 24, 2014	Peer review	Reviewed

Current status: Former featured article candidate

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Untitled

This is a very prominent Sahaba. Could somone give me the previous deleted material so i can re-write it? This article was deleted earlier. --Striver 01:39, 31 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hamza or Abu Bakr

I read in many text that was Abu Bakr, not Hamza, to buy and to free Ammar. Would you, please, control it? --Cloj (talk) 09:03, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Neither is correct. According to Ibn Saad, although Ammar was born a slave, his owner manumitted him before Islam.Petra MacDonald 10:02, 4 October 2014 (UTC)

Someone make sense of this please

I have erased the following passage in the hope that someone knowledgeable will redo it in good English.

...while Shia's respect Ammar us for his loyalty to ʻAlī and is considered by the Shia to be one of the four of the companions of Muhammad who stayed most loyal to Ali's right of succession after the death of Muhammad. He was one of the heroes of the battle of Badr and a commander of some of the army units during it.

This doesn't connect properly to the words preceding it.

Shia's - if 'respect' is a verb, then no apostrophe. If 'respect' is a noun, it is Shia's respect for someone.

'us' - no idea why this is here.

and is considered by the Shia... Who is? As the sentence stands, either Shia or Shia's respect is considered to be one of the companions. Is it 'Umar or Ammar who is considered a companion? Clear that up, and we can probably tell whether 'Umar or Ammar is one of the heroes of Badr.

I appreciate the fact that much information would not be available in English Wikipedia if it were not for the contributions of those who have English as a second language. But the English needs to be checked with someone educated who has native or near-native competence in the language.

Koro Neil (talk) 23:37, 13 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Death of Parents

While it is well established that Ammar's mother was the first Islamic martyr, it is not at all certain how his father died. This man's death is not mentioned in any of the early sources, suggesting that he died naturally.Grace has Victory (talk) 09:35, 21 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

Hi, apologies for neglecting this till now after I said I'd offer comments but, anyway, here are some thoughts on improving the article to B-Class status, perhaps approaching GA. First of all, please understand I'm unfortunately ignorant of the subject, so most of my comments will relate to structure and style...

Structure

The lead needs to summarise the article, so it will generally be a bigger paragraph than you have now, perhaps a couple of paragraphs. You could use the lead as it is now as a first paragraph giving general information, and then add another paragraph with some highlights of his life in chronological order, trying to include a little something from each section of the article.
Generally you should have two or more paragraphs in each subsection, and single-paragraph sections should be minimised. Many headings with short sections tend to make the article look choppy and unfinished, as though there's more information to add. For instance I would certainly eliminate the Role during Abū Bakr's Caliphate and Role during Umar ibn Al-Khattāb's Caliphate subheaders and perhaps even eliminate the Role during Muhammad's Life and Role after Muhammad's death subheaders. Under Legacy, the Public reaction info should just appear directly under Shrine desecration. You can always divide the article into more sections later if you add more information.
I'm not sure about the order of the sections because there aren't many dates mentioned -- if dates (even approximate dates) are known for the events you describe, they should be included.

Prose

There needs to be some clarity in the first sentence. As it reads, I understand that 'Ammar was one of the Muhajirun, but it's unclear whether you're saying the Muhajirun were the most loyal and beloved companions of Muhammad and Ali, or if 'Ammar alone was the most loyal and beloved companion.
Even though you are describing a person of high eminence, try to maintain a cool and dispassionate tone. Rather than saying "most loyal and beloved companion(s)", perhaps use "considered to be the most loyal and beloved companion(s)".
Avoid editorialising, e.g. "Historically, of most noteworthy mention, Ammar ibn Yasir is the first Muslim to build a mosque" should probably just be "Ammar ibn Yasir was the first Muslim to build a mosque", because it's clearly historical and notable.

Referencing

I haven't really gone into the formatting of references but the density of the citations looks sound, i.e. I can't see anything that isn't referenced.
Remember that you don't need to cite things in the lead if they're mentioned and cited in the main body.

These are my initial thoughts, I may be able to add more at some stage. In the meantime, you might see if any other religious leaders from antiquity have Good Articles in WP; I know Jesus is a Featured Article, so that could give you some guidance. Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 15:46, 26 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

dear ian, I am so sorry, I just saw your comments now. thank you much for enlightening us with them and I will do my best to heed them. thank you again sir. Grandia01 (talk) 17:01, 16 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

@Ian Rose: update: hello again Ian, I heeded your suggestions as best as I can. if possible, can you help us with more advices please? thank you again Grandia01 (talk) 20:39, 17 December 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Source Quality

I have removed this paragraph from the article because it contradicts the preponderance of evidence. If it is to be included alongside the traditional version, we will need a strong source to explain why the traditional view is wrong.

Ammar and his parents were tortured in the last year before the Hijra by Mecca's polytheists after their conversion to Islam.^[1] After the persecution of Muslims was over, Hamza and Muhammad's other companions went to the location where the torture and persecution took place; they found every persecuted Muslim -including Ammar's parents- dead except ʻAmmār, who had survived the torture.

First, the date seems wrong. The earliest sources place the torture of Ammar's family long before the Hijra, not just one year, and his mother's death-date is normally expressed as "c. 615" (the Hijra was 622). There was severe torture of the Muslim peasants in the period 614-616. Accounts of the period 620-622 suggest there was harassment and mockery, finishing with a plot on the life of Muhammad himself, but nothing that really adds up to "torture" in the wider Muslim community. The journal cited does not give the date of the persecution. It only mentions briefly that Ammar was tortured, then goes on to discuss whether his recantation of his faith was justified.

Second, no source is given for the incident in which Hamza went to look for bodies and found everyone except Ammar dead. No such incident is mention in Ibn Ishaq, Ibn Hisham, Ibn Saad, Tabari ... etc. In fact none of these sources mention any deaths except that of Sumayya. Important information like this (raising the death-toll from one to an unspecified many; giving the response of the other companions; and changing the date) needs to be properly referenced if it is included.Petra MacDonald 04:18, 27 September 2014 (UTC)

References

^ Kohlberg, Etan (July–September 1975). "Some Imami-shi'i Views on Taqiyya". Journal of the American Oriental Society. 95 (3): 395–402. doi:10.2307/599351. Retrieved 15 April 2012.

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Murderer of hazzrat ammar

Murderer of hazzrat ammar is Fahad hussain bhutto AbUnknown123 (talk) 18:50, 25 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

[Views_on_Taqiyya-1] Kohlberg, Etan (July–September 1975). "Some Imami-shi'i Views on Taqiyya". Journal of the American Oriental Society. 95 (3): 395–402. doi:10.2307/599351. Retrieved 15 April 2012.

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