Talk:Michigan logging wheels

Michigan logging wheels was one of the Engineering and technology good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
October 31, 2020	Good article nominee	Listed
February 26, 2023	Good article reassessment	Delisted

A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on March 15, 2008.

The text of the entry was: Did you know ...that Silas C. Overpack's Michigan logging wheels (pictured), designed to haul logs across rough terrain, were 9 to 10 feet (2.7 to 3 m) high and always painted red?

Current status: Delisted good article

This orphaned talk page, subpage, image page, or similar is not eligible for speedy deletion under CSD G8 as it has been asserted to be useful to Wikipedia.
If you believe it should be deleted, please nominate it on Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion.

Forestry (inactive)

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Michigan

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Use of colour in text

I've undone a good faith edit removing the colour from the text of the word red. I think the use of colour here gives better emphasis. Mjroots (talk) 09:58, 15 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Again, I've had to revert the removal of the colour. Whilst it may not be covered in the MoS, this is one of those occasional exceptions to the normal rules. Mjroots (talk) 07:41, 30 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree that this is one of those exceptions. The red font is unencyclopedic. People know what "red" means and can tell from looking at the images if not. Oh well, have it your way, I won't revert again. But see also WP:OWN. Katr67 (talk) 08:57, 30 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Text has been reverted to black after discussion with the editor who created it that way. Mjroots (talk) 16:55, 30 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Logging Wheels at Michigan Lumberman's Monument

I am fairly sure that there is a set of wheels there, but not sure enough to add it to the article. Anybody know for sure? 7&6=thirteen (talk) 22:01, 20 March 2008 (UTC)Stan[reply]

I e-mailed them and got this answer:

Hartwick Pines State Park is most known for its Big Wheels display. We do not have a set at Lumberman's Monument. signed by Interpretive Services Specialist /Huron-Manistee National Forest --Doug ^talk 19:24, 24 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

So... how were they actually used??

Article doesn't actually say how they were used. How were the logs initially lifted and attached to the wheels? Were both ends of the logs suspended, or just one? Monolith2 (talk) 16:24, 20 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

They were used for skidding, rather than carrying logs. Logs would be dragged to a parallel bundle, with a chain beneath one end, then wheels rolled into place above this end. They'd be lifted with the chain and lashed to the wheels. The wheeled end would now be hauled away, with the tail end dragging.

Dragging sounds crude, and it needs a larger team, but it doesn't need brakes and it's a lot easier to control than a heavy log that's entirely free to roll. Andy Dingley (talk) 16:36, 20 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Dubious statement about color red

The second paragraph ends with the statement, "His [Overpack's] equipment could be identified as genuine as it was always painted red."

I tagged that as being a dubious statement.

Does the author really mean to insinuate that Mr. Overpack was the only person in America capable of buying red paint in 1875?

Anyone could paint their equipment red, and any competitor looking to win business via imitation would be strongly liable to do so. The text indeed seems to indicate that such imitators were in play, hence the need to be able to identify which equipment was and was not genuine. Red paint is hardly a mark of genuinity.

Even if the statement is properly sourced from the link supplied, it's sourcing not to a valid rational academic piece but rather to folklore propogated by a local special-interest museum. Just because you find a link to an old wives' tale doesn't make it a proper source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.210.67.145 (talk) 06:38, 19 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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External links modified (January 2018)

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GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Michigan logging wheels/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Vincent60030 (talk · contribs) 09:44, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hello there, I'll take up on this :D Vincent^LUFan (talk) (Kenton!) 09:44, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Initial comments:

The gallery section has a bit too many images for quite a "short" article. Perhaps take some out and leave it under Commons.

Done

Please bear with me as I am more accustomed with British formats.

Done

Based on this url, I am not too sure if it is a copyvio or a mirror as I can't access the site. Please do let me know thank you!

Done Yes, definitely a mirror. They copied straight off my first paragraph and abruptly ended their sentence on their website as not dependent upon good seasonal (off Earwig) which doesn't make sense. What I created was - they were not dependent upon good seasonal weather conditions. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:46, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Checklinks in general showed no problems, but I did mention some connectivity issues down at discussion section.

Done

Lead

"Some logging companies bought dozens at a time because of the time they could save in their labor costs to get the same work done in the same time period otherwise." this sentence looks disastrous. Rephrase?

Done

History and use

The picture with this caption "Typical lumbering as done by George A. Mitchell when he developed out Cadillac, Michigan." Why was George A. Mitchell never mentioned within the body? If he is related I would like to see more about him or else the caption needs rewording for relevance

Done

Please provide page number for Reference 1

Done

"They extended the timber extraction season for the logging industry in the North Woods of Michigan, by removing the need for frozen icy ground to traverse. The logging wheels were a set of oversized wooden wagon wheels that were specially designed to carry felled trees up to 100 feet (30.48 m) long, several at a time that otherwise could only be pulled out of the woods one at a time." I don't think Reference 6 really cites what is going on here. Could you please elaborate or something?

Done - Replaced with Leavell reference. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:26, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Refs 7 and 9 are dead. Compulsory to cite them as they look likely to be challenged

Done

Sizes

"a quite considerable investment for the time." this looks a bit original research

Done see McCoy quote. Also see quote for "Wheels That Won The West" website.--Doug Coldwell (talk) 18:34, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

"...creating a stabilizing, low center of gravity." Hmm I am on the fence about this since I do not see this cited in the magazine. I am a physics student so I understand this but I am not sure if other readers can assume so.

Done - copy edited accordingly. Took out creating a stabilizing, low center of gravity. The source says - '"The logs were chained to the 16-foot tongue and dragged beneath the axle." --Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:45, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Reference 18: page number please

Done --Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:45, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Locations containing logging wheels

I wonder if this can be written in prose to explain more about these locations which may have factories around for this or something I am just giving an example.

Done

I am not able to check reference 8 and 12 as I cannot connect to them. Any alternatives you can provide?

Done

Reference 8 is not fleshed out properly. I need to click around many links to access where each location is cited. Please provide inline citations for each location.

Done --Doug Coldwell (talk) 14:58, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Not done sorry, I should have clarified. It should be inline for at least those locations where they are not wikilinked to the landmarks themselves. Some of these locations, such as Redding, California, is not cited in the reference unfortunately. Vincent^LUFan (talk) (Kenton!) 05:55, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Done @Vincent60030: Inline references provided. Did I get it correct? --Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:01, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

Overall, it is a cool read. Only some issues here and there Vincent^LUFan (talk) (Kenton!) 09:56, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Vincent60030: All issues have been addressed. Can you take another look. Thanks.--Doug Coldwell (talk) 19:08, 25 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Doug Coldwell: I am so sorry but I have not managed to review the whole article yet, but thank you very much for being so proactive in addressing these issues :D I'll probably take a thorough look again tomorrow if that's okay :D Best Vincent^LUFan (talk) (Kenton!) 02:35, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Vincent60030: O.K. Take your time, as I am busy with other GANs anyway.--Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:17, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Vincent60030: I think I answered your issues. Can you take another look. Thanks. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 15:00, 29 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
@Vincent60030: I am trying to get as many Good Articles as I can for the month of October. If you have time today, can you look over the work I have done so far. Thanks. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 11:02, 30 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Doug Coldwell: Alright, you only have one issue remaining. Shouldn't be too difficult haha. Thank you for a good article! Vincent^LUFan (talk) (Kenton!) 06:09, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Good thing I checked this otherwise the faulty ping would have been missed. This is good to go! Congratulations! Vincent^LUFan (talk) (Kenton!) 11:54, 31 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Copyright contributor investigation and Good article reassessment

This article is part of Wikipedia:Contributor copyright investigations/20210315 and the Good article (GA) drive to reassess and potentially delist over 200 GAs that might contain copyright and other problems. An AN discussion closed with consensus to delist this group of articles en masse, unless a reviewer opens an independent review and can vouch for/verify content of all sources. Please review Wikipedia:Good article reassessment/February 2023 for further information about the GA status of this article, the timeline and process for delisting, and suggestions for improvements. Questions or comments can be made at the project talk page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 09:36, 9 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Deletion

The deletion of Michigan logging wheels^[1] prduced a lot of red links. Peter Horn User talk 21:39, 10 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@MER-C: please consider. Peter Horn User talk 15:35, 11 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

That is not a material consideration when dealing with copyright problems. There's nothing stopping you from creating a replacement, and you don't have to relink everything once you have. MER-C 16:06, 11 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Then I could compose a new text in the old article or compose a new article using text from refences without copying word for word and use the old article name as a redirect. Peter Horn User talk 18:36, 13 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, you can create an article at Michigan logging wheels directly with text that is entirely your own. MER-C 17:54, 16 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

^ Big wheel

[1] Big wheel

[1]