Talk:Morrison Waite

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Term as Chief Justice

Hi. For nearly identical reasons as those outlined in this post of mine, Mr. Waite's term start date should be March 4, 1874, not January 21, 1874. I've corrected and clarified this matter in this edit. I also corrected the patently wrong information about the date being January 22. --MZMcBride (talk) 01:12, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

That would be your opinion. On the other hand I have WP:RSs that are to the contrary. Do you? We are concerned about verifiability, not WP:truth. In any event, the Federal Judicial Center disagrees with your theory. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 03:02, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Did you read any of what was posted here and elsewhere? Which part specifically are you disputing?

The Federal Judiciary says:

Nominated by Ulysses Grant on January 19, 1874, to a seat vacated by Salmon P. Chase. Confirmed by the Senate on January 21, 1874, and received commission on January 21, 1874. Service terminated on March 23, 1888, due to death.

This isn't disputed, it's just the wrong date to use when discussing his term start date. He was confirmed and received his commission in January, but didn't take his oaths until March. The footnotes on the U.S. Supreme Court's site make it clear why the date of the oath is used:

The date a Member of the Court took his/her Judicial oath (the Judiciary Act provided “That the Justices of the Supreme Court, and the district judges, before they proceed to execute the duties of their respective offices, shall take the following oath . . . ”) is here used as the date of the beginning of his/her service, for until that oath is taken he/she is not vested with the prerogatives of the office.

It's also why the various lists on this site use the March 4, 1874 date (e.g., Chief Justice of the United States#List of Chief Justices, List of United States Chief Justices by age, and List of Chief Justices of the United States by time in office). I'm not sure what else I need to do to demonstrate that you're simply wrong. Here are a bunch of Google Books search results that confirm that Mr. Waite took his oath on March 4. What exactly are you disputing?

The U.S. Supreme Court's site says he started his term on March 4, 1874. It says so in several places. I provided a citation for this information in the article and clarified the two dates. I also provided information explaining that the date he took his oath is the relevant date on this talk page and at Talk:Melville Fuller.

Can you explain why you re-inserted the "January 22" date into the article?

Can you please explain your actions in detail? Thank you. --MZMcBride (talk) 03:21, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I reinstated your edit, but tweaked the formats of the references. I suggest that you tweak the formats in the other similar articles you've been changing, as bare URLs are not standard. I also added the Oyez citation. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 08:08, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Awesome, thank you!

Yes, bare URLs are a bit annoying, but I can't really be bothered doing a full citation. I think there are helper bots (and helper humans!) that come around and tidy that up. --MZMcBride (talk) 17:42, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Oyez.org's information

Related to the thread directly above ("Term as Chief Justice"), I just sent the following note to Oyez.org:

Hi.

http://www.oyez.org/justices/morrison_r_waite contains two inaccuracies.

The page currently reads:
---
Commissioned on
Tuesday, January 20, 1874
---

This is wrong. Mr. Waite was commissioned on January 21, 1874. The Federal Judicial Center and multiple reliable sources say so (cf. <http://www.fjc.gov/servlet/nGetInfo?jid=2474&cid=999&ctype=na&instate=na> and rudimentary Google searches).

Additionally, the page currently reads:
---
Sworn In
Tuesday, March 3, 1874
---

This is also wrong. According to <http://www.supremecourt.gov/about/oath/oathsofthechiefjustices2009.aspx> and other sources (e.g., <http://books.google.com/books?id=npdRAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA832&lpg=PA832#v=onepage&q&f=false>), Mr. Waite took his oaths on March 4, not March 3.

Thank you!

Hopefully Oyez.org will fix its entry in short order. --MZMcBride (talk) 17:45, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, and another one:

Hi.

Sorry to bother again, but I found another inaccuracy in this page: <http://www.oyez.org/justices/morrison_r_waite>.

The page currently reads:
---
Left Office
Thursday, March 22, 1888
---

However, according to <http://www.supremecourt.gov/about/members_text.aspx> and many, many other citations, Mr. Waite served until his death (March 23).

Thank you!

Perhaps Oyez.org shouldn't be relied upon? --MZMcBride (talk) 17:48, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Oyez is connected with Chicago Kent law school, and has direct connections with SCOTUS. Not to say that they are nihil obstat, but they are close to being ex cathedra. So I wouldn't get too shaken by a typo. That's my opinion. They have some really good materials that aren't generally available elsewhere. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 17:54, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, the more I dug into it, it seems like a glitch in their system. It's incrementing a few fields by one day for some reason. For example, Samuel Alito started January 31, 2006. Oyez.org even says so in the body text, but in the sidebar, it lists January 30 (twice). Something's afoul. --MZMcBride (talk) 19:11, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I don't own stock in them, and have no vested interest. I do confess to having been a guest lecturer at the school on a couple of occasions, but it's not a conflict as far as I'm concerned. I'm sure they would like to know of their glitch so they can turn it around. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 19:22, 22 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

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External links modified (February 2018)

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