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Talk:Surgeon's knot

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There are several other different knots commonly known as the surgeon knot. The knot shown here is not one that I have encountered before. Here are some examples in common use:

There are also knots referred to as a surgeons loop, useful for creating a loop in a fishing line, for example:

...and the double surgeons knot or surgeons join knot:

I moved the above section off the article page to here because of the first-person comment, and because some of the external links added may not meet the criteria of Wikipedia's exsternal links guideline. -- Donald Albury 00:19, 18 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

  • @StromBer: Please note the guidelines say, "Generally, you should not break up another editor's text by interleaving your own replies to individual points; this confuses who said what and obscures the original editor's intent. In your own posts you may wish to use the {{Talk quotation}} or {{Talkquote}} templates to quote others' posts." And again, I do not understand why you are commenting on material that was removed from the article thirteen years ago. It has gotten rather stale. - Donald Albury 17:04, 6 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You-tube videos

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(Following comment moved from User talk:Donald Albury)

Good man, there was a reason for changing Surgeon's knot video. The English version is wrong! This knot is shown incorrectly at the base with just a simple overhand knot. The first knot must be started with a Double overhand knot. If you want it to be an English-language video, you have to pay attention to it. Thank you. --StromBer (talk) 15:47, 30 December 2019 (UTC)

  • If the video is incorrect, then it should be removed. However, I have some concerns about replacing it with a German language video.
  1. While non-English sources are allowed, they are discouraged. Most readers of the English Wikipedia do not know German (I took 2 years of German [50 years ago], but I am certainly not fluent).
  2. Wikipedia is not a how-to guide. While we are talking about the External links section, where a link to a how-to guide might be acceptable, there is no pressing need to include such a link.
  3. How do we judge whether a video is a reliable source for how to tie the knot?
In short, I would prefer to remove the current link to You tube and not replace it with the link to the German language video. - Donald Albury 17:29, 30 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The video is wrong. The second sentence already writes this. ....Adds an additional twist when tying the first throw and forms a double overhand knot.... And in "your" video just a simple overhand knot is shown, no matter how many surgical hand movements are shown there. Even in the different German videos, the correct processes are not always shown. --StromBer (talk) 19:34, 30 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
As I tried to indicate above, I have no objection to removing the video from The Brain Sturgeon. I would like to see opinions from other editors on whether the German language video is appropriate as an external link. - Donald Albury 21:58, 30 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • There are so many videos that just don't show it properly. And I think it's important that here in Wiki is shown correctly.

I have asked for input from others at Wikipedia:External links/Noticeboard#Linking to a video on how to tie a knot. - Donald Albury 18:49, 31 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I saw the note at ELN. It doesn't matter whether the video is a reliable source, because ==External links== are not supporting article content. Non-English links have to be marked and are discouraged (even more than a non-English source), but they are not prohibited.
I think there might be several good options, and I've left at note at WT:MED to see if anyone can help identify a good one. WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:55, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

How about I simple create a video of a double tie followed by 4 single ties. Which is described as a surgeons knot here.[1]

Specifically the ref says "The first throw in the knotting sequence is often looped or twisted twice, producing the surgeon's knot." This is the technique I standardly use.

I can do one as a tool tie and one as a hand tie. We can get this on either a real person or on a suturing practice device. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 08:32, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

seems like a very good idea, I would be in favor of Doc James suggestion--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 10:19, 5 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Can either of you find such a video? (It doesn't have to be on YouTube, but it should work for people all over the world.) WhatamIdoing (talk) 02:46, 7 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I could make one eventually... Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 08:42, 7 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
That could be uploaded to commons, then no longer an external link --valereee (talk) 14:04, 8 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I associate surgeon's knots with walking boots, which aren't mentioned in the article for some reason. There are videos for using them with boots.[2] Doug Weller talk 12:17, 9 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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