Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Nathan Drake (character)/archive2

The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted by Karanacs 16:45, 11 May 2010 [1].

Nathan Drake (character)

Nominator(s): かんぱい！ Scapler (talk) 21:26, 28 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This was nominated back in January, and received some support. Other issues were brought up, however, and the nomination did not pass. I believe those issues have now all been addressed, and submit the article again for reconsideration. かんぱい！ Scapler (talk) 21:26, 28 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comments. No dab links or dead external links. Ucucha 21:32, 28 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Support Looking through the whole article carefully, I believe that it meets the requirements to receive Wikipedia's highest rating. GamerPro64 (talk) 00:46, 3 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comments on the lead.

Overlinking: "t-shirt", "jeans", and possibly "ad-libbing" (which we're supposed to be familiar with as English-speakers).
"Drake possesses a strong personality"—plain English "has"? I see further down the claim that he is "likable" is ascribed to "many reviewers"; so "strong" is WP's opinion ... possibly if it's not contentious.
Perhaps a colon rather than a semicolon after "environments"?
Is "eye candy" different from "a sex object"? Tony (talk) 08:21, 3 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Response to Tony:

1. T-shirt and jeans de-linked; I am not sure that all readers may know what ab-libbing is however, as it is personally not a word I encounter frequently.

2. I am not sure what you are trying to say here. Possesses is a perfectly acceptable word to use here. Could you elaborate on what you are trying to say in the second sentence?

3. Changed to a colon and removed the phrase "for example"

4. Eye candy and sex object can be used in slightly different situations. Eye candy does not necessarily have to be sexual; a flashy graphic could be considered eye candy. However, in this particular situation with Drake, the words would be used basically the same, so I have removed "eye candy" from the lead so as to combat fluff.

かんぱい！ Scapler (talk) 08:46, 3 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose per 1(a):

Please review comma usage with regards to compound sentences. Examples include the following passages (only the first section and the lead are included, other instances of commas being misused in this manner are all over the article):

Drake possesses a strong personality, and often jokes and quips during the game.
Nathan Drake has been called the new mascot of the PlayStation 3 game console, and is increasingly identified with the platform.
The production staff drew inspiration from the pulp adventure genre when creating the video games in the Uncharted series, and based Drake on the stereotypical characters of adventure films and novels, giving him wit, resourcefulness, and strong principles. (sentence is also a bit drawn out)
if a reaction did not work as planned, or took too long, the production team removed it. (iffy, but IMO that first comma is not necessary)
Drake's physical prowess was modeled on that of Savage, and his personality inspired by the vibrant color and globetrotting identity of Tintin. (though you can also add "was" between "personality" and "inspired" to make that work)
He is not a master of hand-to-hand combat, and throws punches without style or skill.
Matthew Drake was seriously contemplated, but received a poor reaction from those it was presented to.
Eventually, Naughty Dog settled on the name Nathan for its ability to be shortened to Nate, and the perception that it sounded historical.

Other prose issues:

However, with Nathan Drake, the company wanted to produce a more average character, one who did not possess the same amount of confidence, who was more realistic and humble. ("However", a word to avoid in general, is not needed. The second half of that sentence is not very concise, either and needs some tweaking.)
He was deliberately costumed simply in a t-shirt and jeans ... ("simply" doesn't work, suggest alternate wording like "plain t-shirt and jeans" or something similar)
The term, first coined by video game designer Tim Schafer, led to Naughty Dog altering Drake's appearance ... (noun plus "-ing")
Tim Schafer commented "It was all super next-gen ... (I think you're missing an end-punctuation, such as a colon, before the quotation mark.)
Drake wounds Lazaravic, leaving the guardians to kill him, and returns to the village, where he and Elena kiss and begin a relationship. (recommend either a semicolon or a full stop in the middle of the sentence)

Those blockquotes should at a minimum have quotation marks around them to let readers know that they're quotes. Some readers (like me when I read the article) can get confused between actual article text and a quotation.

The paragraphing is rather choppy especially in the "Character design" section (a few one or two-sentence paragraphs), "Personality" subsection, and "Merchandise and promotion" subsection. Paragraphs need to be full, and paragraphs containing only a couple of sentences are to be avoided.

Also, the caption of the lead image is not within WP:CAPTION; if it is not a complete sentence, then no end-punctuation is used. Also, "pictured" is not needed in the Sir Francis Drake photo.

In general, it's going to need another good comb-through on copyediting to meet 1(a). –MuZemike 22:19, 6 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Doing... Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs^(talk) 23:56, 6 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The manual of style says no quotations around block quotes; I will address the other points a bit later when I have the chance. かんぱい！ Scapler (talk) 04:49, 7 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Further, a compound sentence may or may not have a comma. This is more of a stylistic choice than a matter of correctness. I do not believe that the manual of style even addresses it, and our own article on comma gives references stating that using a comma to separate two independent clauses joined with and, but, and the like is a stylistic choice: "Two independent clauses joined by a coordinating conjunction (for, and, nor, but, or, yet, so) or having a complementary relationship[4] may or may not be separated by commas, depending on preferred style." Both Chicago and MLA styles dictate that it is optional as well, though Chicago discourages it, it still recognizes it as correct grammar. かんぱい！ Scapler (talk) 05:11, 7 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I suggest in such instances you try reading the sentences out loud. Generally, giving a pause in such situations makes it sound far better. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs^(talk) 16:07, 7 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I was incorrect on the blockquotes part and has struck that out. Apologies for the misunderstanding. –MuZemike 01:01, 11 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.