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2004 World Series

Article (edit | visual edit | history) · Article talk (edit | history) · Watch • Watch peer review

This peer review discussion has been closed.
I first found this article in this form, and just thought it was very poor. So I've been working on it on and off over the last few mounths to give it a total re-write, remove piontless large amount of piontless trivia and added in refs where needed. I think it's at least acceptable now. But I'm hopful that in this PR, I can continue to improve it, to get it to at least GA status.

Thanks, BUC (talk) 17:26, 18 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Review from Killervogel5

Please note that I will review this article, but it will be piecemeal (aka, I can't do it all right away). I will notify to what point I have reviewed after each group of comments. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 18:12, 25 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox
  • All won-lost records must use en-dashes, not hyphens.
Lead
  • Link 2004 Major League Baseball season as it's written in the lead and then link Major League Baseball later. It should be assumed that anyone clicking through to the season article would then be able to click through directly to Major League Baseball.
  • Just simply having the best record in the league is not the reason the Cardinals made the playoffs; the reason is because they won the NL Central championship.
  • If you are piping one of the series not to include the league's name, it should not be the first one; therefore, change Division Series to National League Division Series and so on.
  • "Both teams have won the World Series since, the Cardinals in 2006 and the Red Sox in 2007." - this fact isn't really lead-worthy.
    • I think so.
      • Does an encyclopedia reader looking for information on the 2004 World Series need to know, as one of the most important facts that summarize this article, that both teams have won the World Series since 2004? I would not expect to see this in an article from a World Series 25 years ago. Additionally, one of the teams had to win this World Series, so it's only tangentially relevant that they have since won it again. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 18:28, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
        • I fair piont but I wanted to put something in the the lead about how each team has done since (or did over the next few years) and it's not often that you will see both WS each return to the WS so quickly. I have re-worded it though so it's less likely to go out of date. BUC (talk) 20:08, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • All game names, since they are referring to a specific and unique instance, should be capitalized (Game 1, Game 2, etc.). Otherwise, they need to be written out (game one), but this is not preferred.
  • "Seven innings from Pedro Martínez where he did not allow a run helped the Red Sox win game 3." - Seven shutout innings might be better, with a link to shutout included.
  • "A home run by Johnny Damon in the first inning," - remove comma
  • "The Cardinals never led in any of the four games in the series and trailed at some point of every inning, in all four games. " - I don't see this anywhere else in the article so it doesn't belong in the lead; also, it needs a reference.
Route to the World Series
  • "then manager Grady Little" - then-manager or former manager
  • Game 7 as per before, etc.
  • "During the off-season the Red Sox hired" - comma after offseason
  • "three run deficit" - three-run
  • "before hurling himself headfirst into the stands." - this sounds POV, it sounds like he wanted to take a header into all those people. Consider a reword.
  • "The Yankees would win the game in the next inning to take an eight game lead in the American League East" - get rid of "would win", they did win; also, eight-game lead
  • "then got in the face of Red Sox catcher Jason Varitek" - got in the face is slang, should be removed
  • "then got in the face of Red Sox catcher Jason Varitek, who then pushed his glove into Rodriguez' face" - too many "then"s
  • "Bench-clearing brawl." - uncap bench
  • "The Red Sox would eventually win the game thanks to a home run by Bill Mueller in the ninth inning.[6] They would win the wild card to earn a place in the post-season for the second straight season.[7]" - get rid of would win again
  • "In the division round of the playoffs" - add comma after
  • "best of five series" - in the lead, you use dashes, make sure they are all with dashes
  • "They swept the series largely thanks to a seven run fourth inning in game one and a walk-off home run by David Ortiz in game three after Vladimir Guerrero had tied the game with a grand slam.[8]" - long sentence, consider breaking it up, also largely could be a weasel word, also seven-run, also Game 3, Game 1
  • "In the American League Championship Series the Red Sox lost the first three games against the New York Yankees and were trailing when they began the ninth inning in game 4." - comma after Series
  • "Kevin Millar was walked by Yankees closer Mariano Rivera, Dave Roberts then pinch ran for him and stole second base before Mueller singled to enable him to tie the game." - this is two complete sentences in one, reword or change the comma after Rivera to a semicolon.
  • "Another walk-off home run by Ortiz won it for the Red Sox in the 12th inning.[9] Ortiz also won game five with a single in the 14th inning, in what was the longest post-season game in baseball history.[10]" - only pitchers are credited with "wins" in baseball, not position players. Saying that that player singlehandedly won the game is incorrect and could be construed as POV. Reword.
    • I never said he won it singlehandedly. BUC (talk) 07:36, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • No, but a reader who doesn't know much about baseball may misconstrue it as such. Consider the difference between the second sentence, and the following: "Ortiz' single in the 14th inning scored the winning run for the Red Sox, in what was the longest post-season game in baseball history." It says the same thing without creating a possible POV issue. I'm just trying to help you head off problems ahead of time. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 18:28, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • Game 5, Game 6, etc.
  • A-Rod does not need to be linked twice. We also already know that Arroyo is a pitcher from above. Trim.
  • "force a game seven having been down three games to none." - add "after" after seven and change to Game 7.
  • "A ten to three win" - A 10–3 win, don't write out box scores.

I have reviewed to the end of the "Red Sox" section and will continue at my next convenience, likely tomorrow evening, my time.

  • "and their division rivals the Chicago Cubs and Houston Astros expected to be strong" - add "with" before their
  • "However" - add comma after
  • "they each hit thirty home runs" - 30 per WP:MOSNUM
  • "they each hit thirty home runs and 100 runs batted in (RBI)" - did they each have exactly 30/100 seasons? If not, consider a slight reword. Also, comma after RBI because of the prep phrase.
  • "four starters recording 15 wins each" - same here, 15 wins exactly?
  • "league best" - league-best
  • "They also allowed the least runs in the league, with four starters recording 15 wins each and closer Jason Isringhausen a league best 47 saves.[15]" - this sentence reads a little awkwardly, but I can't pinpoint exactly why. I'll see if I can be more specific.
  • "took on" - slang
  • "Five home runs in game one and no runs allowed by the bullpen in Game 2," - consistency in game names, Game 1.
  • "In the National League Championship Series the Cardinals faced the Houston Astros where they won the first two games in St. Louis." - commas after series and Astros
  • "However the Astros tied the series in the next two games in Houston before a combined one hitter by Astro pitchers Brandon Backe and Brad Lidge, gave them the lead in series.[19]" comma after however, no comma after Lidge
  • "The Astros tied Game 6 in the ninth inning and Edmonds won the game for the Cardinals with a home run in the 12th.[20]" - again, a reword as per my comments above. Needs a space after the ref too.
  • "A Scott Rolen three run in the sixth inning of Game 7 helped to send the Cardinals to the World Series for the first time in 17 years.[21]" - three-run, and I think you are missing home run
  • "Both teams had lost their previous World Series appearances in seven games. The Red Sox lost to the New York Mets in 1986, while the Cardinals lost in 1987 to the Minnesota Twins. The Cardinals had not won the World Series since 1982. The two teams had previously played each other in the, 1946 and 1967 World Series, with the Cardinals winning both in seven games. The Red Sox had not won the World Series since 1918. The AL had been awarded home-field advantage having won the All-Star Game, giving the Red Sox the advantage at Fenway Park." - every sentence here needs a red. No comma before 1946. If you are going to use the abbreviation "AL" here, you need to specifically delinate what AL means in the lead.
  • "local student Victoria Snelgrove who had been" - comma after Snelgrove
  • "the lead singer of Aerosmith another local band," - comma after Aerosmith (or I would put another local band in parentheses)
  • "Also present at the game were actors Ben Affleck and Jennifer Garner.[22]" - how is this encyclopedically relevant to the World Series?
    • It was a world series game that they were present at. BUC (talk) 22:09, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • That doesn't make it relevant in terms of an encyclopedia entry. "An encyclopedia's article covers... a subject or discipline... and treats it in more depth and conveys the most relevant accumulated knowledge on that subject." I truly don't see the relevance of this statement. Celebrity attendance has no bearing on the Series, or on any individual game. Per WP:NOT, "merely being true, or even verifiable, does not automatically make something suitable for inclusion in the encyclopedia." KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 23:04, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Tim Wakefield made his first start of the 2004 post season for the Red Sox and Woody Williams, who had won both his previous two starts in the post season, was the Cardinals starting pitcher.[23]" - post season needs to be "post-season". Be consistent. Also, Cardinals starting pitcher should be "Cardinals' starting pitcher".
  • "first ever world series at bat." - World Series
  • "Kevin Millar then scored thanks to a single by Bill Mueller to put the Red Sox up four to nothing.[24]" - "thanks to", try not to write like a sportswriter. Wikipedia is not news, it's an encyclopedia, so we need to make sure that it features a professional standard of writing if you are trying for GA or FA. Also, 4–0 for scores, not written out.
  • "The Cardinals score one run" - scored
  • "home run by to right field Larry Walker respectively." - comma after Walker, and check grammar... by to?
  • "However in the bottom of the third" - However,
  • "giving them a five run lead." - five-run
  • "Cardinals bullpen" - Cardinals', and does bullpen really need to be linked again
  • "In the top of the fourth inning" - comma after
  • "Cardinals second baseman" - Cardinals'
  • "who, unintentionally, kicked the ball away" - no commas around unintentionally, add comma after away
  • "Walker hit also hit" - grammar check
  • "and the forth Red Sox error" - fourth
  • "Roger Cedeño would score on the play" - Cedeno scored, it already happened
  • "In the bottom of the eight inning" - eighth, also combine the eighth inning into one paragraph, be consistent with the previous paragraphs
  • "eleven to nine" - 11–9

Have reviewed through Game 1. Will hopefully continue after work today. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 18:28, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • "Boston native, James Taylor" - remove comma
  • "Affleck was present again, as were actors Tom Hanks and Jimmy Fallon, who at the time was making Fever Pitch, where he played an obsessed Red Sox fan.[32]" - again, not encyclopedically relevant
  • "Schilling had, had four stitches" remove one of the hads and the comma
  • "Matt Morris started for the Cardinals on three days rest." - encyclopedically, non-baseball fans won't know why three days rest is significant, explain.
  • "Morris walked Ramírez and Ortiz in the bottom of the inning, Varitek tripled to center field to give the Red Sox a two to nothing lead." - two complete sentences, either semicolon or period, not comma. Also, 2–0.
  • "In the fourth inning" - comma after
  • "a three run lead" - three-run
  • "Mueller committed a World Series record tying third error of the game" - needs a ref that it is a record, also World Series-record-tying (compound adjective)
  • "Mueller committed a World Series record tying third error of the game in the sixth inning, however the Cardinals failed to take advantage." - two complete sentences. semicolon after inning, comma after however.
  • "and two more singles by Johnny Damon and Orlando Cabrera, allowed enabled two more runs to score to make it six to one.[35]" - grammar check (allowed enabled), no comma after Cabrera, 6–1.
  • "Alan Embree replaced Schilling at the start of the seventh inning and he was then replaced by Mike Timlin in the eighth." - why is it relevant that Alan Embree came in just to be replaced. Either remove him or make some mention of his performance (scoreless inning, something).
  • "and also pitch the ninth to end the game" - pitched should be "pitched" (tense agreement)
  • "With the win" - comma after
  • "Cardinals best batters" - Cardinals'
  • "three hits in 22 at bats" - per WP:MOSNUM, comparative quantities should be in the same format, numeral or word, so make it "3 hits in 22 at-bats".
  • "Roberto Clemente Award" should be linked to the award, not the player
  • ""Free Taco Here!"," - no comment
  • "bullpen, with the promise" - no comma here
  • In general, you need to watch out for WP:OVERLINK. There are quite a few things that are linked two or three times in close succession due to the boxscores.
  • "Once again" - comma after
  • "off former Red Sox pitcher" - off of
  • "The starting pitcher for the Red Sox was Pedro Martínez and in the bottom of the first inning he allowed the Cardinals to load the bases with one out." - commas after Martinez and inning
  • "Edmonds then hit fly ball" - hit a fly ball
  • "Ramirez in left field" - comma after
  • "and ending the inning as a result" - and ended, tense agreement
  • "In the bottom of the third inning" - comma after
  • "on third, to run towards home plate" - no comma
  • "However Suppan" - comma after however
  • "left center" - left-center
  • "Red Sox's" - Red Sox'
  • "Johnny Damon then led off the Red Sox's fifth inning with a double to right and singles by Orlando Cabrera and Ramírez singled to right and left respectively, scored Damon to make it three to nothing." Split this sentence up, very long.
  • "Mueller then singled sharply" - then is unnecessary
  • "enableling" - spelling
  • "Suppan was then replaced" - then is unnecessary
  • "none of Cardinals three starting pitcher had finished five innings" - none of the Cardinals' three starting pitchers
  • "Martinez was pinch hit for" - don't end a clause with a preposition. Use active voice instead: "Mike Timlin pinch hit for Martinez in the top of the eighth inning."
  • "shut out" - shutout
  • "game for the Red Sox four to one" - Red Sox, 4–1
  • There are no Cardinal pictures in the article, could be construed as bias. Consider adding.
  • "country music singer Gretchen Wilson, performed" - no comma
  • "performed "The Star-Spangled Banner"[42]" - comma after
  • "and the Hank Aaron Award for the American and National league were presented to Manny Ramírez and Barry Bonds respectively." - League, and consider a reword to eliminate this passive voice. Also, comma after Bonds
  • "Former Cardinal players," - no comma
  • Link "Boys & Girls Clubs of America"
  • "Damon, hit a home run" - no comma
  • "give Red Sox" - give the Red Sox
  • "for the forth straight game" - fourth
  • "Ramírez then singled" - no then
  • "three run lead" - three-run
  • "nobody out," - no comma
  • "Red Sox starting pitcher Derrick Lowe was pinch hit for during this inning" - it's Derek Lowe, and remove passive voice by naming the pinch hitter (i.e., xxx player pinch hit for Derek Lowe)
  • "Red Sox closer Keith Foulke," - no comma
  • "Foulke threw is underhand" - huh?
  • "Red Sox first title" - Red Sox'
  • "Although the series was won in St. Louis, 3,000 Red Sox fans were present at the game, despite this the World Series trophy was presented the the Red Sox clubhouse." - semicolon after game, comma after "despite this"

Reviewed through the end of Game 4. Will continue later. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 23:04, 26 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • Why is the final section called "Continuity"?
  • "The Red Sox win" - Red Sox'
  • "assumed by most" - who? needs ref
  • "which was supposed the have" - to have
  • "had been sold" - was sold
  • "On the Cardinal's side" - Cardinals' or Cardinal
  • "disappointment was expressed" - by who? replace passive voice
  • "the team failure" - team's
  • "game is the series" - in, and capitalize Series, it's specific
  • "It was believed by most," - who, and remove comma
  • "that the Cardinal had not played" - Cardinals
  • "three of the Cardinals best hitters" - Cardinals'
  • "following Saturday, 30 October" - October 30 format is used throughout the article, so be consistent
  • "The team were transported" - The team was
  • "that were equipped" - that were is extraneous language, equipped with loudspeakers is sufficient
  • "so that the players" - remove that
  • "to include Charles River" - the Charles River
  • "Also for this reason," - extraneous, remove
  • "10 am." - see the section of MOS on time for formatting suggestions on this
  • "and then Storrow Drive" - remove then
  • "accommodate for members of the media" - remove for
  • "as is pass under Massachusetts Avenue bridge." - as it passed under the Massachusetts Avenue bridge.
  • "part way" - partway, or "part of the way", which would be more professional
  • "which he held on to for the rest of the parade.[56]" - probably turns the previous into a run-on, make this a separate sentence.
  • "of the 2005 season" - you mention that it's the team's season so link to 2005 Boston Red Sox season instead
  • "Carl Yastrzemski," - remove comma
  • "to provide music" - it's obvious that orchestras provide music, this should be removed
  • "During the ceremony" - comma after
  • "After this a much bigger banner was unfurled" - remove after this, change to "A much larger banner was then unfurled"
  • ""2004 World Series Champions"." - italics should only be used for emphasis, remove
  • "Marine," - Marines or Marine Corps (latter preferred)
  • "James Taylor then performed" - remove then
  • "America the Beautiful" - comma after
  • "were then held" - remove then
  • "team's owner" - comma after
  • "Both would also win two of the next three World Series" - change to "Each would also win one of the next three World Series"
  • All quotes must be referenced.
References
  • You must check all of the references throughout the article; they have to be consistently formatted. All references to MLB should be capitalized, and make sure that every reference has a work, a publisher, or both, and that the publisher names are correct. All web references need to have an access date. A lot of MLB articles don't have an author listed. Most game wrap-ups don't have this info, and that's fine, but articles have to have it.
  • Make sure all references meet the qualifications of WP:RS.
  • External links need to have titles instead of just names of websites. We don't know what we are linking to.

Alright, well, this was quite a read. I hope that I was able to help. Please make sure that once you are finished implementing whichever of my suggestions you deem necessary, that you review WP:MOS and WP:OVERLINK along with the entire article before nominating it for WP:GA. I am still watching this page, and can certainly come back to check over it again. I hope I helped. If this review was helpful for you, please consider reviewing for someone else. Thank you! KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 02:33, 28 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

    • I think I've coved everything you've pionted out but you might want to give it another read to see if you czan see any new issues, or ones you've missed. Thanks for the feedback. BUC (talk) 21:54, 1 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
      • I will re-review the article in 1-2 days, to give myself some time to step back and re-approach with fresh eyes. If I re-read it too close to the original review, I tend to be not nearly as thorough. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 21:57, 1 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
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