Wikipedia:Peer review/Erichtho/archive1

Erichtho

I've listed this article for peer review because I would like to one day promote it to a good article. This page details "Erichtho", a legendary Thessalian witch who was made famous by her appearance in Lucan's epic poem Pharsalia. In this work, she performs a gruesome necromantic ritual that revivifies a corpse. I put a lot of time into this, but (as always) I'm worried I overlooked something, mis-read a source, or skipped over an obvious grammatical error. Any corrections or suggestions would be much appreciated!

Thanks, Gen. Quon (Talk) 20:54, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

Comments by Caeciliusinhorto

• I would re-write the first line of the first section (In Literature/Lucan's Pharsalia). Perhaps "The character Erichtho seems to have been popularised by the Roman poet Lucan in his epic poem Pharsalia". Essentially I think the problem is that what is there currently could stand to be trimmed a little.

  Done.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

• In the footnote nb1, what do you mean by the "release" of Pharsalia? Is that the same as "publication"? Or is "publication" not really a thing in Latin literature?

  I'm not super sure on the details, but there weren't really publishing houses in Rome. These poems were just sort of thrust upon the world.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

  I should clarify this and say that there were not publishing houses like there are today. They still got published, so I changed it.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:18, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

• You source "impious" with a quote from the poem in translation. Personally, I think your interpretation is fine; with my wikipedian hat on, however, I suspect that it might fall foul of WP:NOR. It would be fantastic if you could find a secondary source for that just in case.

  Good point. I didn't think of that when I translated it. I'll find a source.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

• I'm also confused by the reference there (currently at #7) to "Lucan, Pharsalia, ll. 6.523–524". The quote in question is at book VI, lines 523-4, but I don't see what the "ll" is for... You do the same thing for your other quotations of Lucan, so presumably it means something, but I can't for the life of me see what.

  It's an abbreviation for 'lines'. Do you think it's redundant?--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

• Of course it is. I think it's fine, it was just a brief moment of stupidity on my part. Caeciliusinhorto (talk) 10:02, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

• What do you mean by "post-bellum battlefield"? Is "post-bellum" necessary?

  Good point.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

• "as well as a rather ambiguous (at least, to Sextus Pompeius) prophecy": presumably the point here is that there is dramatic irony as the prophecy was not ambiguous to the reader in Lucan's day, who knew they outcome of the clusterfuck that was the late republic? You should probably come right out and explain this the the (probably highly theoretical) lay reader, though...

  I struggled with this section when writing it. I'll keep pondering it. For right now, I added a link to 'dramatic irony', but I'll try to find something better.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Caeciliusinhorto (talk) 18:45, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for responding to this! This has been very helpful.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 21:16, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Comments by llywrch

Actually, just three comments:

• Second paragraph in the lead begins "Lucan's role in Pharsalia has been much discussed by classicists and literary scholars, with many arguing that she serves as a antithesis and counterpart to Virgil's Cumaean Sibyl..." -- Don't you mean to write "Erichtho's role"?

  Oh, that's embarrassing. Thanks for that.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 19:05, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

• In the notes at the bottom, the article mentions that Erichtho was also a character in one of Ovid's poems, likely created by him. However, in the body of the article there is not one mention of Ovid. I think something needs to be said about Ericththo in Ovid, if just to explain her role in his Heroides. (In neither article about that collection of related poems, is she mentioned even once.)

  Good point. I added a bit about him.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 19:05, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

• Some background about legends/folklore of Thessalian witches would be helpful. For example, were there many such stories? Was Thessaly notorious for having witches in Classical times? Or was Erichtho the only known witch to live there, & another part of Greece/the Balkans was notorious for witches. (I remember reading that in medieval times, certain villages in England were notorious for being alleged centers of witchcraft.)

  Good point as well, I will do that.--Gen. Quon (Talk) 19:05, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Otherwise, this article is fairly well detailed, well-written, & appears to be on its way to GA status. -- llywrch (talk) 16:22, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

I appreciate your helpful comments!--Gen. Quon (Talk) 19:05, 13 May 2016 (UTC)