Wikipedia:Peer review/Parinda/archive1

Parinda

I've listed this article for peer review because I want to take it to the FAC. Constructive comments are welcomed. Thanks in advance. Yashthepunisher (talk) 14:02, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

Comments from Veera Narayana

So, i am here to comment on the article of "The Most Powerful Film Ever Made". Privilege indeed!

• What do you mean to say through he word "scenario"?

Chopra has been credit with 'original story and scenario' in the film. Yashthepunisher (talk) 19:55, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

• "Chopra wrote its story and scenario, while Shiv Kumar Subramaniam wrote the screenplay." -- close repetition of "wrote". Please avoid.
• "Anna's men kill Karan's friend Prakash (Kher) in front of Karan; the two brothers are then caught on different sides of morality when Karan decides to murder Anna." -- Can you find some other way to write this sentence in a way where the wording is minimal?
• Kishan in lead, Kishen in plot, Kishan in Cast. Please mantain consistency.
• Karan also discovers Anna is Prakash's murderer and Kishan works for him. -- Karan also discovers Anna is Prakash's murderer and "that" Kishan works for him.
• "Kishan also briefs Karan about Anna's rivalry with Musa" -- briefs? That means Kishan must be knowing that Karan is aware of his "employment". Or, is it about Kishan saying it as a matter-of-fact and Karan learning it that way?
• Karan tells Paro Anna and his brother killed Prakash and he was unaware about it. -- Karan tells Paro "that" Anna and his brother killed Prakash and he was unaware about it. Plus, his henchmen were credited with the murder of Prakash earlier, no?
• The sentences regarding the casting of Shroff, Kapoor and Patekar lack proper flow. For example, "Kapoor told Chopra that Patekar was not suitable for the role of his elder brother" is a sentence followed by "Anil Kapoor, who was cast in the role of Karan, asked Jackie Shroff to play his elder brother." Those parts need re-writing.
• "While filming the final scene's fire sequence, a fire the crew lost control of a fire they built using rubber solution and petrol, leading to Patekar suffering from serious burns." -- You mean to say "the film's crew lost control of a fire they built using rubber solution and petrol, leading to Patekar suffering from serious burns"??
• "The film was filmed and is set in Mumbai." -- film was filmed, eh? legitimately sounds like trouble was troubled.
• "Tum Se Milke" is one of the most popular romantic numbers in Indian cinema. Great. But, a single source supporting it isn't nice.
• "While reviewing Vikram Chandra's 2007 novel Sacred Games (who is Anupama Chopra's brother)..." -- Do you even need to mention her when Mr Chandra has an article of his own?

More, if any, later. Veera Narayana 13:58, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

Veera Narayana All done. Thanks for the comments. Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:16, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

Comments from Kailash

• You may want to mention the budget in the body of the article. The infobox already does.
• Naseeruddin Shah and Nana Patekar were considered for the role of Kishan - Since they have been introduced a few sentences before, you may just mention them by surname here.
• Where is the source that Vinod Chopra Films themselves distributed Parinda?
• Parinda was shot in 66 days - you mean 66 working days right? I know you do, just somehow avoid the impression that it meant 66 consecutive days.
• In the track list table, link the people on first instance only (avoid WP:OVERLINK).
• The Central Board of Film Certification gave the film an 'A' (restricted to adults) certificate, due to its depiction of violence - the source doesn't mention violence as the reason (though I'm pretty sure that's the reason). Don't mention a film's rating unless there is extra commentary about it per WP:FILMRATINGS.
• Nikhil Advani should be Nikkhil Advani. Sometimes these superstitious Bollywood freaks think adding a single letter (or removing) can bring them luck.
• The film was included in CNN-IBN's 2013 list of the "100 greatest Indian films of all time" - somehow find a way to fit CNN-IBN's current name CNN-News18.
• Replace "publisher" with "website" wherever necessary (exceptions are offline sources). Kailash29792 (talk) 15:58, 10 May 2019 (UTC)

Kailash29792 All done. Thanks for the comments. Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:16, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

Comments from Aoba47

• I would add ALT text to the infobox image, and make sure that all of the images used in the article have appropriate ALT text.
• Is the infobox image the theatrical release poster? If so, I would clarify that in the caption as "Poster" alone is somewhat vague.
• The end of the lead's paragraph reads somewhat like a list of all of the people involved. I would encourage you to look at featured articles on films to see how this is handled, because I am not sure all of these credits are necessary (particularly for the article's very first paragraph).
• I would change the final part of this sentence (The film stars Nana Patekar, Jackie Shroff, Anil Kapoor and Madhuri Dixit in the lead roles, with Suresh Oberoi and Tom Alter in supporting roles.) as I have always been told during GAN and FAC reviews to avoid the "with..." sentence construction. I personally see nothing wrong with it, but I have gotten this note multiple times.
• For this part (after Karan decides to avenge his friends death from Anna), I would change "from" to "by" as that sounds better to me in this context. Also, there should be an apostrophe for "friends death" (i.e. friend's).
• I was a little confused by this sentence (It is considered by many to be the turning point in the introduction of realism in Hindi cinema.). Who are the "many" being referenced here? Scholars? Reviewers? Audiences? The cast and crew? This needs clarification.
• For this part (Parinda also won two National Film Awards and five Filmfare Awards,), I do not think "also" is needed.
• I have a question about this part (Karan, unaware his brother is working for a gang, returns to Mumbai after completing his studies abroad). Does the film specify what he studied or is it kept vague/generic?

It is never mentioned what he studied. Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:17, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

• I have not seen the movie so apologies in advance on all of the plot-related questions. I was confused by this part from the "Plot" section (Knowing this, Kishan books Karan a seat on a flight to Delhi to avoid involving him in this situation). How does Karan taking a flight back home lead to him avoiding the situation? I would imagine Prakash would want to meet greet him upon his arrival regardless and thus this trap would still be set up for his death. I would clarify this in the process. The later part of the sentence also does not make sense to me. How does the flight delay lead to Karan being present at the shooting and Prakash dying in his arms? It just feels that a lot is left out here.

The place and time decided for murdering Prakash matches with his meeting with Karan. Knowing this, Kishan does not want his brother to get involved into this mess and thus he books a flight. Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:17, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

• I would also just say "books Karan a flight" as I do not believe "a seat on a flight" is necessary.
• I would revise this (a previous messenger of Anna) to (a former messenger for Anna) as the current wording reads weirdly to me.
• I have a comments about this sentence (Karan discovers Anna is a criminal who killed his own family, since then he is afraid of fire.). Could you briefly clarify how Karan discovers this? Also, the connection between the first half of the sentence (the discovery) and the second (the fire) seems somewhat awkward to me. I would revise this.

Iqbal tells him everything. Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:17, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

• For this part (Karan also discovers Anna is Prakash's murderer and that Kishan works for him. Kishan also finds out about Anna's rivalry with Musa.), I would avoid over-using "also".
• I was also confused by this part of the sentence (Kishan also finds out about Anna's rivalry with Musa.) as it talks about a new character "Musa" without really introducing him to the reader.
• I have two comments about this sentence (Later, Karan recognises Abdul as one of Prakash's killers and decides to testify against him.). I would clarify what you mean by "Later". Later the same day, week, month, year? It is rather vague right now. Also who is Abdul? This is the first mention of the character in the section and there is no introduction.
• For this part (Kishan warns Karan that if he does not back off,), I would use something different than "back off" as it sounds a little too informal to me.
• I have a comment about this sentence (When Anna's men arrive and shoot at Karan, Kishan is shot and wounded in the crossfire and is treated by a nurse.). The last bit "and is treated by a nurse" is awkwardly tagged on to the end of the sentence. If read literally, it means that Kishan was treated by a nurse during the shoot-out, which I am assuming does not happen. I would revise this part further.
• I am really confused by this sentence (During testimony at the police station, Abdul tells Karan that if he testifies, the nurse treating his brother will kill him.). So Abdul threatens Karan during a testimony at a police station and the police do not notice? Also there needs to be something in front of "testimony", like his or clarifying who is testifying.
• In the above sentence, there is somewhat of a repetition of "testimony" and "testifies". I would really look into this sentence as a whole as it reads awkwardly to me.
• For this sentence (Karan leaves in fear of his brother's life.), leaves where? The police station? The country?
• There is a quite big jump in the plot to these sentences (He later joins Anna's gang. Anna, testing his resolve, tells Karan to kill Iqbal. Iqbal shoots himself so Karan can execute his plan without any guilt.). What do you mean by "his plan"? Is the audience informed about why he joins the gang or they left in suspense about the decision?
• For this part (Later, Anna orders Karan to kill Musa and sends Francis to escort him.), again what do you mean by "Later"?
• For this sentence (Later, Anna orders Karan to kill Musa and sends Francis to escort him), who is Francis? For this sentence (Rama Reddy is kidnapped and taken to Mussa, who offers him work.), who is Rama Reddy?
• For this part (With the help of Musa), I would say "With Musa's help".
• For this part (finishing all the three of Prakash's killers.), I would say "the last of Prakash's killers" . Something about the current wording seems weird to me.
• I have two comments about this sentence (Karan and Paro get married and decide to leave the city and settle in their old village.). Are there any previous scenes between the two characters to show that they are developing a romantic relationship? It seems somewhat random that they are getting married. Also this is the first time you mention they are from an "old village". In the first sentence, it says that Kishen and Karan grew up in Mumbai so Karan has not been connected with this location. What is this "old village" being mentioned?
• There is quite a bit of repetition of "kill" in the "Plot" section's final paragraph, such as (Anna goes out to kill Musa, believing Musa killed his men). I would try to fix this. There is also a lot of repetition of the characters' names.
• I would request a copy-edit from the WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors as I think that the prose for the "Plot" section needs to be improved prior to an FAC. Having someone look at the overall article would also be helpful.

I hope that I do not sound overly critical with my above comments. I have only gotten through the lead and the "Plot" section, but I stopped there as I was genuinely getting confused with the plot summary. I hope this comments help. I always feel awkward doing reviews. Aoba47 (talk) 22:57, 21 May 2019 (UTC)

Aoba47 Thanks for these comments. I have hopefully resolved them and I will tweak the plot section as well real soon. Can you please review the rest of the article as well? That would be very helpful. Also, sorry for responding so late. Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:17, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

• Thank you for the response. I would make sure the plot is understandable to someone who has not watched the film. I know that this is tricky since you are immersed in it as the writer that it is hard to step away. I always found this tricky for a film with a larger plot, as I normally work on individual television episodes where I could lean on the show's main article and individual character pages to help an unfamiliar reader. I understood the basics of the film, but there were just a few places that left me questioning why something happened or who that person was if that makes sense. I will get to the rest of the article either tomorrow or on Monday if that is okay with you. I hope you are having a good weekend so far! Aoba47 (talk) 20:39, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

• Sure. Thanks! Yashthepunisher (talk) 20:42, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

• This is a clarification question. For this sentence (The story was based on two brothers who worked for a gangster named Ashwin Naik.), do you mean that the film was based on a real-life situation? I just wanted to make sure that I understood correctly.
• For this part (Chopra cast Nana Patekar in the elder brother's role after he saw the latter in a play called Purush.), I think you can just say "him" rather than "the latter".
• For this sentence (Anil Kapoor, who was cast in the role of Karan, told Chopra that Patekar was not suitable for the role of his elder brother.), did Kapoor provide any reasons why he felt this way?
• For this sentence (The film was initially named Kabutarkhana and was later changed to Parinda.), would it be helpful to provide an English translation of the original film title?
• For this part (was Gordon Willis cinematography in The Godfather (1972).), remember to put the name in the possessive form.
• For this part (both Chopra and Pradhan looked at the paintings of), I do not think that "both" is needed.
• I do not think the wikilink for "flute" is needed.
• For this part (Singer Shaan made), I think it should be "The singer Shaan made".
• Is there any further information for this part (but found some people were not happy with it.), like why they were not happy with the film?
• I am not sure if this sentence is really needed ( Madhuri Dixit was cast for Parinda after auditioning for the part.) as it is rather normal for an actor to be given a role following an audition. Unless there was something noteworthy in the audition, I do not see why it is needed.
• Could you clarify this part (The film's climax was shot at the Gateway of India on three different New Year Eves) for me? It could be read that it was shot over three years. I am assuming you mean three different parties/events on the same day, considering the film was shot in 66 days. I would try to clarify this to prevent confusion.
• I would be consistent with how you represents numbers over ten. I see instances with numerals (i.e. 66 days) and instances with words (i.e. thirty takes). I do not have a preference either way, but it is important to be consistent throughout.

You have done wonderful work with the article as a whole. I should definitely check out this film sometime in the future. If you have the time, I would greatly appreciate any comments for my current FAC. Either way, have a wonderful rest of your night! I look forward to seeing this put up for an FAC. Aoba47 (talk) 02:31, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

Aoba47 Thank you for your comments. I will leave mine pretty soon on your FAC. Cheers! Yashthepunisher (talk) 19:52, 27 May 2019 (UTC)

• Thank you. I hope that I could help at least a little. Aoba47 (talk) 20:16, 27 May 2019 (UTC)