Wikipedia:Peer review/Real Madrid C.F./archive8

Real Madrid C.F.

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This peer review discussion has been closed.
I've listed this article for peer review because I think it has chances to become a featured article, in the future. However, I know that a big problem would be the references, but maybe the article itself has some issues...so...

Thanks, Hadrianos1990 ^talk 16:39, 20 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

As the editor who got FC Barcelona to FA I can recommend you buy or borrow Phil Ball's book on Spanish football, read it thoroughly and add stuff to the article. Once you've added some good sources, remember to use three/four more books, ask for a copyedit and then finally a PR. That should send it off for FA, but it will take time. Sandman888 (talk) 18:39, 20 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Jappalang

Lede

Is it needed to spiel every trophy they won in the league?!

"... was given by the King ..."
Which king?

"... several teams in Spain have got this royal distinction:"'
"... several other Spanish football teams also received this royal distinction:"

"Real Madrid has spent its entire history in La Liga, ..."
Real Madrid is not a living entity that can decide to "spend" its time doing something.

"In the 1940s, the Santiago Bernabéu Stadium and the Ciudad Deportiva had to be rebuilt following the Spanish Civil War."
What has this to do with Real Madrid?

"... in Spain and Europe (known as La Quinta del Buitre), ..."
Europe is known as La Quinta del Buitre?

"The team's traditional home colours are all white, ..."
A layman might come to think this means the team's stadium is painted all in white. Avoid football jargon.

"... and the second most valuable worthing over €950m in 2008."
"Worth" is not a verb; hence, there is no such word as "worthing" unless you mean the town in South England.

Early years, Civil War and Franco (1902–1945)

"... on 6 March in 1902."
There is a redundant word.

The source referred to (http://www.realmadrid.com/cs/Satellite/en/1202730681095/noticia/Noticia/Real_Madrid_turns_106_%28I%29.htm) makes no mention of New Foot-Ball de Madrid or Club Español de Madrid.

"Real Madrid led the first edition until the last match,"
I am fairly certain "edition" is not synonymous with "league".

"The Whites won the League again the following year, ..."
Who are the Whites? Barcelona?

Santiago Bernabéu Yeste and European success (1945–1978)

"... the club, the Santiago Bernabéu Stadium and the Ciudad Deportiva were rebuilt following the Spanish Civil War."
What are the Santiago Bernabéu Stadium and the Ciudad Deportiva? When were they built in the first place?

"In 1955, acting upon the idea proposed by the French sports journalist and editor of L'Équipe Gabriel Hanot, and building upon the Copa Latina (a tournament involving clubs from France, Spain, Portugal and Italy), Bernabéu met in the Ambassador Hotel in Paris with Bedrignan and Gusztáv Sebes and created an exhibition tournament of invited teams from around Europe that would eventually become what today is known as the UEFA Champions League."
This is a long sentence with some redundant ideas (does it matter where they met). Break it apart and summarise.

"Winning the competition five consecutive times saw Real permanently awarded the original cup ..."
Avoid anthropomorphising an event; how does it (without sentience) "see"?

Is "nationally born" a common term?

"a first in the competition."
Which feat was the "first in the competition"?

As a newspaper, Diario Marca should be in italics.

"The club played its first UEFA Cup Winners' Cup final in 1971, being defeated by English side Chelsea 2–1."
"The club played its first UEFA Cup Winners' Cup final in 1971 and lost to English side Chelsea 2–1."

"In his honour FIFA decreed three days of mourning during the tournament."
"The International Federation of Association Football (FIFA) decreed three days of mourning to honour him during the tournament."

"The following year, the club organized the first edition of the Santiago Bernabéu Trophy in the memory of its former president."
Unsourced.

Los Galácticos, Calderón and second Pérez era (2000–present)

"His campaign vowed to erase the club's debt and ..."
Again. avoid anthropomorphising. "He vowed in his campaign to erase the club's debt and ..."

"... the club controversially got its training ground rezoned ..."
What is "rezoned"? Why was it controversial? Without explanation, the adjective becomes a biased term.

"... purchasing Cristiano Ronaldo from Manchester United for a record breaking £80 million."
Unsourced.

Statistics and records

I think it is better to start off with club statistics rather than player statistics.

Why should Figo's 127 caps be linked with Real? He certainly did not earn all of them with the club.

All records should be made clear whether they are club-level, nation-level, or international-level.

"Officially, Real Madrid's highest home attendance is 83,329 for a Copa del Rey match in 2006."
Do not force readers to go to another article just to figure out what that term is. Suggestion: "Officially, the highest home attendance figure for a Real Madrid match is 83,329, which was for a football cup competition, Copa del Rey, in 2006."

"Real have also set ..."
It was all singular until here, why?

"The "Whites" also hold ..."
Why is Whites now in quotes?

"Raúl González is the all-time UEFA Champions League top scorer, with 66 goals. The team has the record number of consecutive participation in the European Cup with 15, from 1955–56 to 1969–70."
Unsourced.

Support

"... by season ticket holders, of which there are average of 68,670."
There is a missing word, but still, the sentence could be rephrased.

"To become a season ticket holder one must first be a socio, or club member. Not all members are able to get a season ticket."
Why (on the second sentence)?

How is "To become a season ticket holder one must first be a socio, or club member. Not all members are able to get a season ticket. In addition to members, the club has more than 1,800 peñas (official, club-affiliated supporters' groups) in Spain and around the world. Real Madrid has the highest average all-time attendance in Spanish football and regularly attracts over 65,000 fans to Santiago Bernabéu; it was the second best-supported La Liga team in the 2004–05 season, with an average gate of 71,900." sourced to "On the first place was Barcelona with an average gate of 76,000."?

El Clásico

Who or what is "Ghemawat, Pankaj. p. 2"? Does this source truly back up "There is often a fierce rivalry between the two strongest teams in a national league, and this is particularly the case in La Liga, where the game between Real Madrid and FC Barcelona is known as El Clásico. From the start of national competitions the clubs were seen as representatives of two rival regions in Spain: Catalonia and Castile, as well as of the two cities. The rivalry reflects what many regard as the political and cultural tensions felt between Catalans and the Castilians, seen by one author as a re-enactment of the Spanish Civil War."

Note: Based on the sourcing discrepancies found above, I find it hard to trust that all the information given are backed up by the citations and have stopped reviewing content from this point on.

Tables

Why are the countries represented in flags not identified on first use? This violates WP:MOSFLAG, causing accessibility issues.

Why should technical staff have flags next to their names? On what grounds does this not violate WP:MOSFLAG's guidelines on inappropriate flag use?

General

There are several tags for expansion.

Several sections are not sourced at all.

References

For a club this big, there should be books dedicated to the subject or are of academic focus on the football scene. These are preferred over websites and newspaper pieces and should be used instead; so why are books listed here if they are not even used at all? Surely, there should also be more books about Real Madrid or Spanish football than these?

Images

File:Logo Real Madrid.svg: "Because it is a logo there is almost certainly no free equivalent." is incorrect. Is this a copyrighted image? Why is it copyrighted and for how long? Those are the questions that should be answered. 350,000 pixels is high resolution; 100,000 pixels is the recommended low resolution level. Why should the logo be of this high resolution?

File:Real2007.jpg: Can an admin check the licensing is correct when the image was at Wikipedia and update the Transfer log?

File:Mourinho CSKA Moscow 05042010 2.jpg: a check with an OTRS member should be made to verify that the ticket is authentic (it was not attached by an OTRS member).

The above points to a serious makeover before the article should be submitted to FAC. Jappalang (talk) 00:48, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]